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New Tab Ratings

johnny [staff]
Posts: 915
the quick version: Danny feels that injustice has been done to a particular ex-member of these boards.
Posts: 1499
So..the solidarity scenario posited earlier.

So if the consequence is that Danny or “minions” down rate all the tabs that get submitted and no one, consequently, wants to submit tabs, which hurts BBT and all of us that want to learn new songs, why not let him take his toys and go home? Perhaps we're beyond that by now. And of course, that assumes that once Danny's tabs were down, the evil bad guys would stop doing evil bad things.

And I really want that Burger King crown
johnny [staff]
Posts: 915
That's a bit exaggerated. Obviously we need better protection when it comes to rating tabs to prevent this kind of behavior. It's just that fixing stuff like this at 2am after a few beers takes some time

As I said, ratings are currently disabled - I will revert all ratings to yesterday's ratings and reset the ratings of new tabs. Then we'll make it unabusable.

If we take action that the “minions” want us to take, means that we reward this kind of behavior with compliance.
LoudLon [moderator]
Posts: 1540
The notion of demanding one's tabs to be removed is ridiculous to me. There is no law on BBT which dictates that every member must submit tabs. When you do so, it is strictly voluntary. Furthermore, when you create a tab, you're depicting music owned by someone else so it's not like hosting a tab is a violation of copyright, anymore than creating that tab of someone else's music itself is a violation of copyright.

I understand if, say, you submit a tab here, then it's stolen by someone and submitted to another site, with the thief taking the credit for your work. Or even if you submitted it somewhere else then a thief took it and submitted it here, then you, as the author, asked for its removal. But neither of those are the case here. Danny submitted his tabs just like the rest of us – voluntarily, and knowing full and well that once you put something online, there's no taking it back. Danny's tabs are still going to have Danny's name on them. Nobody's stealing his tabs, nobody is claiming credit for his work and he's still free and clear to post those same tabs on his own site or other sites. There is no theft here. And he'd be rendering the time and effort he put into creating them and submitting them fully wasted.

I don't see any kind of upside to that.
TheDude [staff]
Posts: 285
if i may offer my own opinion, it really all became a matter of principle. there are more than 50000 tabs on this site. if we removed every single tab from the top 10 submitters, it still wouldn't leave much of a dent in terms of sheer numbers. the BBT staff isn't afraid of losing content, there's plenty of it.

we receive a fair amount of unlawful takedown requests, most of them threatening legal action. we know they are wrong, so they are all respectfully told to sod off. when danny requested his stuff to be taken down, our first response was “sure thing, why not”. but before we actually replied, we had a bit of a conversation and realized that the reason for his request was nothing other than a childish attempt of vengance for his friend being banned. had he actually produced a solid argument as to why the tabs should be removed, it would've been taken seriously.

do not mistake this for stealing his work, we wouldn't dream of it. the credit is his, and his alone. but writing the lines, getting credit for them and owning them are different things entirely. you don't own the tabs you submitted. you just submitted them. we don't own them either, which is why we strongly oppose deleting them. you submit them to the site, so they now belong to the community. as the author, you get to edit them, but you do not get to destroy them.

anyway, danny shouldn't be singled out as some villain here. when i mention him here it's just to illustrate the situation, my points stand in general. anyone asking for content to be removed for no good reason will be ignored or mocked. his account was banned because it was compromised (though we suspect he gave up his password willingly, which unfortunately is also a bannable offense).

before the trolling / multiple accounts / harassing members / threatening staff started, we didn't even have banning mechanisms. it gives me pain that i had to spend the last couple of days staring at logs and searching for trolls, writing systems that will prevent this in the future and restoring tabs. my time should've been spent on features that people will enjoy, not features that will keep them away. it's a damn shame.

there are a few lessons to be learned here.

members need to learn that the content they submit is here to stay. we will not yield. also, if you make any attempt to start unprovoked fights, if you troll the boards or harass any member of the site, you will be banned without warning. we have now become too large to have a 3 day back-and-forth with anyone breaking the rules. everyone knows the rules, don't play dumb with us.

we, the staff, must learn that with a big (and most of the time awesome!) community, there will always be one or two malicious pricks who will give it their best to ruin our day.

i'm sorry the rest of the community had to witness this ugly, unnecessary thing. i sincerely hope this sort of thing will not happen again, and if it does, i hope we can contain it much quicker than we did this time.
johnny [staff]
Posts: 915
The ratings have been restored.

For a short time ratings will remain disabled.
Posts: 924
I don't know if an “annoying @$!#'s” input is welcomed on this issue or not, but I'll throw it out anyway:

Why is the rating system open to the public? Can you make it to where only registered users have the ability to rate tabs? And can the ratings be tracked to the user?

I would think that would show where personal vendettas are occurring, and encourage registration, no?
But then not all of the tabs will have all the ratings. I've gotten a lot of random 2 star ratings on some of my tabs. Soooo registration won't stop anyone from giving low ratings for no reason
johnny [staff]
Posts: 915
Why is the rating system open to the public? Can you make it to where only registered users have the ability to rate tabs? And can the ratings be tracked to the user? I would think that would show where personal vendettas are occurring, and encourage registration, no?

Anonymous votes were enabled because we felt that this would encourage more people to vote. The overall sentiment of tabbers was that people are not voting enough.

Up until now there was no abuse, so I guess we'll have to fix that. Thanks for the input

Don't worry, we'll figure out a smart way so that people will rate and malicious ratings will get deleted. There are ways to detect them.
Posts: 924
True, but then you would see who is giving the rating. And the user may be able to justify their rating. But I think you'd also see where user-x continuously gives tabber-y low scores buy gives tabber-z consistent high scores highlighting inconsistency or personality driven ratings.

I don't know what the resolution beyond that would be, but at least you'd have a sense of why something is being scored low, or who is being a douche.

The anonymity is a good concept, but in light of recent tantrums it may thwart a lot of undeserved low ratings.

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